![]() 10/03/2018 at 23:03 • Filed to: None | ![]() | ![]() |
What If? More like WTF. Not a problem I would assign.
![]() 10/03/2018 at 23:12 |
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42.
![]() 10/03/2018 at 23:13 |
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Hmm looks like standard equation creation followed by lol wut?
So... the equations would be...
A = 50 + B
B = 30 + C
and 2(A + 50) - 70
= 3(C+50)
Three equations, three unknowns.... so there is that. Not sure even what that last one is asking. Like if it is asking if m = m then it is asking if B = C and that is a no.
Edit: Not sure I got that 3rd one right...
![]() 10/03/2018 at 23:15 |
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6 volts
![]() 10/03/2018 at 23:15 |
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Okay so A=B+50, and C = B-30 therefore A=C+80
2(A+50)=(3(C+50))-70)
2(C+80+50 )=(3(C+50))-70)
The answer is...
I don’t fucking know it’s been years since I’ve had to do this kind of thinking.
Update: OH LAWD IT’ S COMING BACK TO ME
2C+260 =3C +80
260=C+80
C+80=A
A=260
Right?
![]() 10/03/2018 at 23:18 |
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I can’t get there at all. Maybe I’m in the wrong line of work.
![]() 10/03/2018 at 23:20 |
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I have no idea. I’ve been a math teacher for 16 years and this is a ridiculous problem. I like how they inserted a line break in the second line just to torment the reader.
![]() 10/03/2018 at 23:20 |
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Alexa and Zack are both wrong and the question about them makes zero sense.
![]() 10/03/2018 at 23:23 |
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That seems very weird? To be honest, I’m not entirely sure what they are even asking? I think the answer is that yes, there answer will be the same (assuming Alexa and Zack can successfully do algebra) because it doesn’t matter what you name your unknowns as long as they are consistent?
Also I got A0=260 B0=210 C0=180, which seems consistent (I didn’t use m for any of my unknowns)
Showing my work :
A0 = B0 + 50
B0 = C0 + 30
A1 = A0 + 50
B1 = B0 + 50
C1 = C0 + 50
2A1 = 3C1 - 70
2(A0 + 50) = 3(C0 + 50) - 70
2A0 + 100 = 3C0 + 150 - 70
2A0 = 3C0 -20
A0 = C0 + 80
2(C0 +80) = 3C0 - 20
2C0 + 160 = 3C0 -20
C0 = 180
B0 = 210
A0 = 260
![]() 10/03/2018 at 23:23 |
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My son in 7th grade has to do journal
ing in math class, this includes drawing pictures and shit that have noting to do with math.
![]() 10/03/2018 at 23:24 |
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![]() 10/03/2018 at 23:25 |
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I don’t care how many miles your car has Alexa and Zack, solve your own damn problem, like all math problems :P
![]() 10/03/2018 at 23:27 |
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A=B+ 50, B=C+30, C=B-30
2(A+50)=3(C+50)-70
2(B+100) =3(B+20)-70
2B+200= 3B-10
B=2 10
Yes, I’m that bored.
![]() 10/03/2018 at 23:27 |
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The problem is completely wack, though my son-in-law claims to have solved it:
![]() 10/03/2018 at 23:28 |
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The bus driver’s eyes are the same color as Zack and Alexa’s . What do I win?
![]() 10/03/2018 at 23:29 |
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I can’t get past the fact that they’d expect Algebra 1 students to tackle something like this. My son-in-law offers a solution:
![]() 10/03/2018 at 23:31 |
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on the right track:
setting parameters:
a = b+50; b = c+30 / c = b-30 (as you said)
drivings an hour: 2(a+50) = 3(c+50) - 70 which is 2a + 100 = 3c + 150 - 70 which is 2a = 3c - 20
[replace a and c here with your beginning parameters]
2(b+50) = 3(b-30) - 20; which is 2b + 100 = 3b - 90 - 20
consolidate(3b-2b)=100+90+20 or b=21 0
a = 210+50; or a=260
c=210-30; or
c=180
![]() 10/03/2018 at 23:32 |
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... shit that have noting to do with math.
What are you, an implorable ?
In my classroom, I dispense with all the crap and teach the basics because that’s what’ll get ‘em out of high school and what they’ll be taught in college math classes. Common Core is a pile of crap foisted on a bunch of educators who can’t teach it because it’s either not how they were taught or because they’re too weak to teach well anyhow. I’ve pretty much ignored it and because tenure, #jobsecurity
![]() 10/03/2018 at 23:32 |
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I gave you the answer in the reply to ess :)
![]() 10/03/2018 at 23:32 |
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I think I solved it!
![]() 10/03/2018 at 23:34 |
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I re-opened the editor right away and eventually got it.
![]() 10/03/2018 at 23:34 |
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Express the answer as a polynomial.
![]() 10/03/2018 at 23:35 |
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B=210. Solved for the wrong variable whoops.
![]() 10/03/2018 at 23:35 |
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Alexa and Jack were making out in the backseat.
![]() 10/03/2018 at 23:36 |
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My son-in-law claims:
![]() 10/03/2018 at 23:36 |
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Zack and Alexa were making out in the backseat.
![]() 10/03/2018 at 23:38 |
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He’s got the -70 on the wrong side of the = in the third line.
![]() 10/03/2018 at 23:40 |
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My 89 year old grandmother was a double major, math and physics. Spent a few decades teaching math, and I remember how annoyed she would get at the way math was taught nowadays.
“too much unnecessary fluff!”
![]() 10/03/2018 at 23:41 |
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Yeah, I don’t think the kids were actually supposed to solve the equations. That is the question Alexa and Zack are solving, not the question the students are solving. All they are asking of the students is whether assigning a variable name to a different unknown will change the outcome, and of course it won’t. They will get different values of m: Alexa will get m=C+30 while Zach will get m=C, but their value for the initial mileage on C will be the same.
Also I think your son in law has a “-70" where he should have a “+70" which is why he got a different answer than me (it’s possible I’m mistaken, I’m operating on about 2 hours sleep, but I have read it several times now).
![]() 10/03/2018 at 23:42 |
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If you say so. What do you do for a living, besides moderate Oppo?
![]() 10/03/2018 at 23:43 |
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That’s how I see it. Too bad she’s not around to help us solve this problem.
![]() 10/03/2018 at 23:45 |
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Kids who are like, “you mean,
the numbers with the letters?” have lots of fun with existential Algebra like this. I was getting paid good money to tutor a high school sophomore and I saw this and felt like I should offer his mother my resignation.
![]() 10/03/2018 at 23:49 |
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I don’t moderate oppo anymore but I’m a farmer. I did study engineering before going back to the family business though.
![]() 10/03/2018 at 23:51 |
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Did you decide you’d had enough of the mod thing? What do you farm and where
abouts?
![]() 10/03/2018 at 23:53 |
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No, you’re not. This is a pile of hot garbage cooked up by adults (some of whom must be on the autism spectrum) who think that just because they understand the question they’re asking, the kids being asked the question should be able to understand it too.
![]() 10/03/2018 at 23:55 |
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I offended someone the other day and they called me a snowflake, I was like yeah I like being different.
![]() 10/03/2018 at 23:55 |
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There was a disagreement, I was voted off the island. I hold no resentment over it.
We have pigs in Ontario, Canada.
![]() 10/04/2018 at 00:00 |
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Yeah, 260 is right for A. They were asking for C, but it’s pretty trivial to get there if you have A.
![]() 10/04/2018 at 00:05 |
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I think you may be slightly off the mark. The people who cook up crap like this are either academics who want us all to know how clever they are — to justify their existence — or educators who have very little idea what they’re talking about.
You’re off the mark on “pile of hot garbage” as well, because that’s way too generous a term for it.
![]() 10/04/2018 at 00:08 |
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If no offense was intended and they opted to take some anyway, then they were a fool.
![]() 10/04/2018 at 00:09 |
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See, my smart ass answer would’ve read:
It is conceivable that their answers would be the same. However, it is impossible to know what assumptions fictional math problem characters make as to the mileage of a BMW (B) and a Chevy (C). Now, if you’re asking me whether Alexa and Zack both set the problem up correctly and properly solved it, I cannot answer that as they have not provided me with their work. I, however, made no assumptions, and worked the problem out to answer how many miles the BMW had initially, that answer is below.
[maths] because I’m too lazy to actually do it but would have in school.
[maths]
[maths]
[maths]
[maths]
[maths]
It’s a good thing my mother was a well liked teacher in the same school system, otherwise I can’t imagine my teachers putting up with my nonsense the way they did.
![]() 10/04/2018 at 00:11 |
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One or more of the mods use this platform as their progressive bully pulpit. I resent that, frankly, and perhaps if I were a bigger man, I wouldn’t. But I do because I resent bullying.
Pigs, eh? Are you a national security risk? (Our president is such a horse’s ass; sorry about that; I didn’t vote for the guy.)
![]() 10/04/2018 at 00:14 |
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Alexa and Zack were fogging up the windows.
![]() 10/04/2018 at 00:15 |
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Yeah they were!
![]() 10/04/2018 at 00:17 |
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They were actually asking for B, and I already realized my mistake
![]() 10/04/2018 at 00:17 |
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With a name like Humpkins, how did you not figure that one out?
![]() 10/04/2018 at 00:21 |
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Oops, yes you are right, obviously I wasn’t paying much attention myself...
![]() 10/04/2018 at 00:24 |
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I can’t/ won’t speak to that because I don’t have time to be here that often anymore and avoid political/volatile topics like the plague when I do.
I will say I t’s not worth the time/aggravation to resent what are in the end meaningless arguments in our obscure little corner of the internet.
I am an immigrant so I might be considered a national security risk, I guess. :P The border does tend to be a bit of a process for me, though not as bad as others.
I don’t believe the changes to NAFTA affect us much (I haven’t delved into such details just yet) so don’t worry about it. The political upheaval is somewhat entertaining from my perspective in a schadenfreude sort of way while hoping there isn’t too much collateral damage.
![]() 10/04/2018 at 00:29 |
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...I can’t even comprehend what that is asking . And I took Calculus 2 in college . What happened to just teaching kids math?!
![]() 10/04/2018 at 00:33 |
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But if you divide miles (m) by the numbe r of fucks I give (f) you get an error, because you can't divide by zero.
![]() 10/04/2018 at 00:37 |
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I wasn’t trying to draw you in so much as to have a #MeToo moment. I’ve found many very meaningful moments in this obscure corner and I try to just let the haters hate.
Immigrant? To Canada? I was trolling Donald Trump there, which I suppose you picked up.
Our politicians are pathetic, with saddeningly few exceptions. I hope it’s better in Canada.
![]() 10/04/2018 at 00:39 |
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Same, pretty much.
![]() 10/04/2018 at 00:54 |
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Letting
f
= the number of f#$ks you give, and
since you replied _at all_,
f
> 0. However, the value of
f
,
being
infinitesimally small,
causes
the ratio
m/f
to
be infinitely large. In other words, since you
only
barely
give a f#$k, the influence on the system is significant. Conversely, if you gave significantly many f#$ks, you would shrink the ratio and, therefore
, the significance of
m
.
QED.
![]() 10/04/2018 at 01:16 |
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Ah but I learned in math that .000000000000000001 is functionally zero in certain equations.
![]() 10/04/2018 at 01:24 |
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As an engineer, I would give you a scathing look and subtly imply that you go fuck yourself while asking increasingly inane questions to boil this down to a digestible mess.
That’s the real world approach.
![]() 10/04/2018 at 02:40 |
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To reiterate a clarification: common core isa set of standards, not a curriculum. If a problem assigned is nonsensical, you should almost certainly
be looking at (and complaining about)
the curriculum, not the standards. As a math teacher, the common core standards are fucking awesome. As a math teacher, a lot of the curricula being peddled to districts are not awesome. If there's a problem with the problem, you need to be advocating your district geta better curriculum, not advocating getting rid of common core.
![]() 10/04/2018 at 03:03 |
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A = B + 50
B = C + 30
2(A+50) = 3(C+50)-70
B = A -50
A - 50 = C + 30
A = C + 8 0
2(C + 80 + 50) = 3(C+50) - 70
2C + 260 = 3C + 150 -70
C = 260 - 80
C = 180
That gives
B = 180 + 30
B = 210
A = 210 +50
A = 260
For the assumption about m miles and m miles, you only need to be able to see that
B = C + 30
And hence Zach and Alexa’s “m” will be different. Whether they ultimately get the same answer will depend on whether or not they get any further than that (as in, if Zach and Alexa both use “m” as a placeholder, they could still potentially both get the correct values for A, B, and C).
Also, this is solving a system of linear equations, which makes it fair game as
an Algebra I problem, albeit an advanced one that I would (realistically) only expect my honors kids to get, especially without some pretty significant coaching.
I’m not sure when or where you taught, but in every context I’ve taught in, there’s a crazy amount of pressure to “prepare” kids for standardized tests which absolutely have these kinds of problems on them. Unfortunately that can lead teachers to pass on these (often) unrealistic expectations to their students.
With that said, in a school where I had two parent homes with at least one college educated parent: I wouldn’t bat an eye about assigning this problem. This is a problem they will be expected to be able to solve when they hit Algebra II, Pre-Calc/Trig and Calculus. There will be non-linear versions of this problem, and if they can’t set up the linear versions, learning the non-linear ones will be all that much harder (and those classes have their own challenges aplenty).
![]() 10/04/2018 at 06:14 |
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You know, I see the “answer” posted below, but I couldn’t even get that. I’m okay at math, but I suck at Algebra. And I for sure would get a zero on this test because I would just give up since the original question is utter bullshit.
![]() 10/04/2018 at 07:17 |
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So basically you’re saying I just insulted piles of hot garbage?
![]() 10/04/2018 at 07:46 |
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Except that functionally, you still replied, so it ain’t zero enough.
![]() 10/04/2018 at 07:48 |
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Well, I hope you wouldn’t do any of that to
me
, because I did not write the problem. Posting this thing
on Oppositelock is my method of mocking it without risking a cramp to any of my facial muscles by giving scathing looks.
![]() 10/04/2018 at 07:57 |
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I’m a lazy teacher in a confused school district. At 54, I’ve only been teaching 16 years, which is a good deal shorter a time than the majority of teachers who, unlike me, have never had real jobs; they’ve only been teachers. I’m also proficient in a number of trades including electrical, carpentry, automobile mechanics, I.T., and some other areas.
There are few things that will glaze over my eyes than a bunch of eduspeak. People make entire careers for themselves, and write “educational leadership” on their resumes, and sit around and spew jargon that makes no sense to anyone but them and a bunch of academics who teach about teaching but have done little themselves of standing in the front of a room full of children.
So for me, I’m not advocating anything to anyone because doing so is
a complete waste of time. I show up, play grandpa to a bunch of 8th graders whom I happen to enjoy
very
much, and watch them grow and flourish. And I teach them some Pre-Algebra. And I avoid as much of the nonsensical crap as I can and, since I’m tenured, I get away with it. Am I teaching math? I think so. Am I making an
impact
in kids’ lives? Surely I am, but I just hope it’s a net positive impact.
![]() 10/04/2018 at 08:04 |
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In real life.... Zach, over time, will simply get tired of always arguing with Alexa and just agree with everything She says.
![]() 10/04/2018 at 08:07 |
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I wrote another reply to you, prior to this one. When I began teaching, at 38 years of age, I thought I’d like to teach Calculus some day. The high school where I began teaching had exactly ONE section of Calculus and the better part of 2,000 students. I started out teaching Pre-Algebra and 16- and 17-year-olds would routinely show up not being able to tell me what was the product of 6 and 9.
Rare, in my career, has been the student with two original parents and one or more college degrees in the house.
I provide private tutoring to children who struggle in math classes called “Integrated 2" and “Integrated 3,” where the kids’ complaint is that their teachers talk a lot, they themselves talk but little, and they’re placed into groups and made to figure out problems by themselves. “Socratic,” I guess that approach is called. A sophomore came to me yesterday with half a dozen problems for homework, completely disparate, and including this one as the last one.
I am not ashamed in the least to say that the problem made my brain hurt, was exceedingly difficult to read, and might be entertaining for a few physicists in the break room at Aerojet.
![]() 10/04/2018 at 08:08 |
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I see no place for it anywhere.
![]() 10/04/2018 at 08:10 |
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I suppose. Public education is an expensive boondoggle run by politicians and educrats that measures and rewards whiteness.
![]() 10/04/2018 at 08:13 |
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And enjoy snuggles and lead a happy life and pursue a successful career where he will never encounter anything like this unless his career has him plotting the course of a satellite around an asteroid, in which case he will still likely think it’s a stupid problem.
![]() 10/04/2018 at 08:59 |
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Haha I know, I’d only do that to the people writing this problem! :p
![]() 10/04/2018 at 09:03 |
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I’ve always found it humorous and tragic that teachers are not required to have any real world experience. And that someone like me, who has run a successful business for the last 15 years (through that “ recession” no less) can not get a job teaching a high school business class without a teaching degree. I really wish I could pass on all that I’ve learned to more than just my sons. But instead, America’s sons and daughters will be taught “business” by some dope who’s never run one. And this applies to all sorts of professions. We really should allow specialty classes to be taught by qualified members of the public, rather than only professional teachers.
![]() 10/04/2018 at 09:21 |
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But instead, America’s sons and daughters will be taught “business” by some dope who’s never run one.
In other words, teachers, too often, have never held
a real job.
You’ve struck upon something here that is near and dear to my heart. I began teaching at age 38 and discovered that I am cut out for the work. I am also proficient in a list of trades including electrical, carpentry, automobile mechanics, photography, information technology, and I served in two different branches of the U.S. military.
I’m a lousy businessman.
All those jobs and interests make teaching more interesting.
What kind of business?
![]() 10/04/2018 at 09:34 |
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I’ve had some excellent conversations here as well, that’s why I’m still here. I only refer to volatile/political discussions on this forum as meaningless because very rarely is anyone’s opinion changed. E motions almost always let the discourse get disrespectful and it’s just not worth the time only to resent the end result, or the lack thereof.
Yep, I immigrated to Canada with my family in 2002. I may as well be Canadian at this point but I enjoy a bit of self deprecating humour about being an immigrant and the pitfalls that come with that, minor as they are in my case.
Terrible politicians are universal, to varying degrees depending on where you are, with good ones being few and far between. We’ve got our sour grapes here as well, I assure you.
![]() 10/04/2018 at 11:09 |
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Structural composites for industrial applications. We compete against steel and aluminum in corrosive areas.
I’ve learned so many things that are never taught in business classes (I’m sure because they aren’t in textbooks). It makes me sad for all of the kids in poorer school districts who likely don’t have that role model in their personal life to pass on these lessons. I’m convinced
that 90
% of mobility failure is the lack of an example of how to succeed in life. Schools can’t provide this, and all too often home life is just a tutorial on failure. Until we break that cycle, we will continue to fail these kids.
![]() 10/04/2018 at 11:55 |
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Our college core construction management classes were all taught by industry folks that had loads of experience in their fields. It was excellent. And rife with good stories about real experiences that had to do with the lessons for the class. There is definitely something to be said for teachers who have actual real world work experience.
![]() 10/04/2018 at 11:59 |
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I’d like to see basic bookkeeping and budgeting as a course somewhere in high school. I had to learn from my parents, which weren’t great role models in that respect, and then I had to figure a bunch out on my own throughout life. But why not teach real life skills that could actually help a kid out?
![]() 10/04/2018 at 12:03 |
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How about in a college atmosphere? Could you teach there? I know most of my professors for my core classes were all current or past construction folks that actually lived the lessons. And a couple just taught once or twice a week and still built homes as a profession. We even got to tour different homes being built. Very cool. And my statics instructor was a county building inspector. He was the coolest old dude I came across in my 4-5 years in college. And I learned a great deal.
Might be an option for you?
![]() 10/04/2018 at 13:03 |
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This, so much this. You could even have guest teachers come in for a week or two to talk about retirement planning, basic investment concepts, etc, all with a real life
angle to them.
I know that personal financial theories can sometimes be controversial, so I’m sure that’s why it’s not really taught in high school.
![]() 10/04/2018 at 13:41 |
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I was in a foul mood so I probably should not have said anything at that time....
![]() 10/04/2018 at 18:59 |
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Where did you immigrate from?
![]() 10/04/2018 at 19:02 |
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Wait: you’re not a snowflake?? I always thought...
There’s nothing like relative anonymity to magnify a lack of emotional intelligence.
![]() 10/04/2018 at 20:18 |
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I’m from the Netherlands. I need to visit again soon, it’s been too long since I’ve seen some of my family.
![]() 10/06/2018 at 10:07 |
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Zack has done well for Himself...so He has people on retainer to handle these issues.
Another glass of Cabernet, anyone?
![]() 10/11/2018 at 12:15 |
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Good morning. I am circling back to say that your comment, standards versus curriculum, provided me an important distinction that I had not heretofore considered. So thank you; helpful to have that.
Here is something unrelated, that I was recently shown, that I will begin incorporating immediately into my practice:
My Favorite No